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Crossposted Nii-meta!
(originally posted in LJ.)
So I went on and on and ON about Nii again....
This time with visual aids, WOO!
I think the gauge on the poindexterometer just maxed out here you guys. XD
...The depressed nihilist business made me go 'oh goddamn it man D:' so very much. I mean, that's the most D:-inducing example of doin Buddhism rong from him I have ever seen. Like, the basic concept of something not necessarily negative somehow parses into...that.
I want to clobber him with a foam Nerf bat a couple hundred times, then hug him. Then clonk him again for good measure XD;
I don't even know, man. I have this thing about antagonists. And I kep being afraid that people think I'm woobifying them by focusing on their humanity. I don't intend to - after all, human beings can be astoundingly cruel as much as we can be endlessly compassionate, and Nii's jackass antics are out there and obvious and while I think that WHY he pulls some of the shit he does doesn't get discussed often (not because people are stupid but because it's sometimes really hard to say), WHAT he does is easily accessible every time you crack open a manga from volume five onward.
His dickery fascinates me, but the moments where he mask slips a little and the genuine punkass peeks out are even more fascinating.
Minekura hasn't made him a complete monster. Is he sometimes a raving cock? Hooooo you bet your ass he is, but that's not all there is to him, and fans who write him as an infallible all-knowing jackwax and nothing else are missing a lot of who the guy is. For some reason some fans like to think that's all there is to him and actively deny that there's anything more going on. I once saw a vry young-seeming fangirl flailing for quite some time in the comments of an EXCELLENT Koumyou/Ukoku fic. I kind of knew she wasn't very bright because she was of the 'bottoming partner is less masculine/lesser than the topping partner/a dick-damsel*' school of thought and she had a lot of fucking trouble with the fact that (a) it looked as if Ukoku was going to be on the bottom and (b) Koumyou was ultimately the uke in position but the seme in matters of who was driving. But man, I have never seen anyone complain so much about a character being depicted in a well-rounded manner! Ukoku's snark was very much intact, he was still the uber-wiseass, an when Koumyou said, 'yeah, that sounds good actually' to his innuendo he had no idea what the fuck which I think is realistic for the time the fic was set in. Like you could hear the record-needle-scratch 'Ukoku's brain just fell over' noise. Koumyou gets that reaction from him a FEW times in the manga. XD The way it was done in the fic made sense, and since both of them had been hitting the pomegranate sake a bit in-fic before Koumyou went 'okay ^_^' to the double entendres, Ukoku WOULD be less able to keep his mask perfectly in place. He drops it quite a bit around Koumyou anyway, and in such a situation, I think it's plausible that it WOULD slip completely.
But this fan just went on and on and on about how she didn't understand where this VULNERABILITY ever came into Ukoku's character, where it was in the manga, ohmygod hyperventilation look at my failure to understand that positions in bed don't affect whether or not someone has a ween, and could NOT understand the polite, well-thought-out replies from the author or other commenters at ALL. I mean, she got given page numbers and volumes and explanations of interpretation and continued to NOT GET IT on a grand scale.
People can be extremely kind to one person and then turn around and be crazily vicious to another for no real reason - or for some bullshit reason they pulled out of their anus to make themselves feel better. They can rationalize all kinds of godawful behaviour (and I don't doubt that Nii has an explanation for every single bit of crap he pulls). Vulnerability in some situations is not universal weakness, and someone's humanity will not necessarily prevent them form being a raging cock. People do horrible shit for love. Humans are compassionate, generous, kind, nurturing and decent, but they're also small-minded, selfish, nasty, careless and ass-tick-y. When I talk about Nii's humanity I'm talking about all that shit, positive and negative. XD
I don't know whether or not he screwed up Kami on purpose or whether Kami was screwed up to begin with and Nii had no idea what the fuck to do and...well, considering his examples of how2mentor are both extremely weird, and Nii is weird, Kami would most likely get weirder. I certainly think he took advantage of the kid's gigantic fucking heartmark, but I don;t know if he set out to make Kami weirder if only because Kami was already pretty bad-off mentally on account of being a war orphan and on account of having to do what he did to survive. The human psyche is both extremely fragile and extremely resilient. Messing Kami up would be easy and Nii has this Thing about challenges. Doing it rite as a teacher would be MUCH harder. PROBLEM: the teacher whom everyone says is the normal one is adfgj,yrlktkwgf yeah Goudai I still think you are a dick! ...Anyhow. Through Goudai, Nii 'figured out' that the ideal student is a very obedient sort...we can see where this is going. Even if Nii didn't set out to make Kami weirder, Kami was liable to get weirder. tl;dr I don't know WTF his intentions were in re: Kami and I probably never will.
I think it's likely that the idea of Nii having a fuckhuge crush on Koumyou or even loving him hurts some of the 'EVIL GENIUS DEITY!' fans' minds because there is this perpetuating idea in culture that love is an all-powerful force of redemption and that any person in love will be saved. That no one evil can really love. Which - okay, first of all, EVIL IS AN ABSTRACT and in many cases relative. There are people out there who would think I was fucking godawful and bosom buddies with Lucifer because I like another woman. There are people out there who think I'm a puppykicking bitch because I refuse to subscribe to their worldviews. Shit, one of my friends was once dating this sparklehorse wonkpagan thingiee who was utterly convinced I was demon possessed because I wouldn't and didn't act the way she expected me to or automatically defer to her (and people went along with this because they were not very bright and/or it was easier to throw my ass to the curb than deal with her bullshit - I assume it was the latter). I'm not even kidding. BUT I DIGRESS! Love is awesome but it's not an all-powerful all-redeeming force and it's in part Nii's love for Koumyou that leads him to be such a dickwagon to Sanzo. Love alone cannot save someone. Love is part of a much larger equation when it comes to redemption. Love all by itself is just one facet of a relationship.
It's a powerful thing. But it's not all-powerful. So yeah!
THIS GOT DISJOINTED TOO! *throws shoe and headdesks* tl;dr focusing on someone's humanity doesn't mean denying the other aspects of them. I fully recognize the fact that Nii is an ass, and it's his moments of openness and humanity that make his jackassdom that much WORSE. It's those moments that make you scream WHY WOULD YOU FUCKING DO THAT, DUDE.
I think the fans who don't think Nii is capable of love are the same fans who forget that Gonou was batshit insane and that the series does not make excuses for him (the Three Aspects remind Sanzo that Hakkai is working to redeem himself and ask him not to forget that - this is important). Hell, HAKKAI does not deny that he was batshit insane. Minekura is damn good. XD She likes Yisou (and so do I) and it's made clear that while he has a right to be angry he doesn't have a right to seek revenge like that and wreck people's lives. He has a right to be pissed off but mother of fuck he's going way too far, dude, why did you make yourself into a shiki, that's fucked up.
(I'm going to ramble some time about how Yisou is totally a hungry ghost archetype...)
XD; IN CLOSING I like Minekura a lot and I could fangirl all day but I have to cut this short because I have to run flailing off to work. Whee!
in closing, JESUS CHRIST Japan is speedy, I ordered my stuff on Thursday and it got here just now.
--
*'Dickdamsel' is an excellent term I picked up somewhere or another for the particularly-spineless whiny fangirl-Japanese-uttering sort of uke/bottom who shows up in bad slashfic.
So I went on and on and ON about Nii again....
This time with visual aids, WOO!
I think the gauge on the poindexterometer just maxed out here you guys. XD
...The depressed nihilist business made me go 'oh goddamn it man D:' so very much. I mean, that's the most D:-inducing example of doin Buddhism rong from him I have ever seen. Like, the basic concept of something not necessarily negative somehow parses into...that.
I want to clobber him with a foam Nerf bat a couple hundred times, then hug him. Then clonk him again for good measure XD;
I don't even know, man. I have this thing about antagonists. And I kep being afraid that people think I'm woobifying them by focusing on their humanity. I don't intend to - after all, human beings can be astoundingly cruel as much as we can be endlessly compassionate, and Nii's jackass antics are out there and obvious and while I think that WHY he pulls some of the shit he does doesn't get discussed often (not because people are stupid but because it's sometimes really hard to say), WHAT he does is easily accessible every time you crack open a manga from volume five onward.
His dickery fascinates me, but the moments where he mask slips a little and the genuine punkass peeks out are even more fascinating.
Minekura hasn't made him a complete monster. Is he sometimes a raving cock? Hooooo you bet your ass he is, but that's not all there is to him, and fans who write him as an infallible all-knowing jackwax and nothing else are missing a lot of who the guy is. For some reason some fans like to think that's all there is to him and actively deny that there's anything more going on. I once saw a vry young-seeming fangirl flailing for quite some time in the comments of an EXCELLENT Koumyou/Ukoku fic. I kind of knew she wasn't very bright because she was of the 'bottoming partner is less masculine/lesser than the topping partner/a dick-damsel*' school of thought and she had a lot of fucking trouble with the fact that (a) it looked as if Ukoku was going to be on the bottom and (b) Koumyou was ultimately the uke in position but the seme in matters of who was driving. But man, I have never seen anyone complain so much about a character being depicted in a well-rounded manner! Ukoku's snark was very much intact, he was still the uber-wiseass, an when Koumyou said, 'yeah, that sounds good actually' to his innuendo he had no idea what the fuck which I think is realistic for the time the fic was set in. Like you could hear the record-needle-scratch 'Ukoku's brain just fell over' noise. Koumyou gets that reaction from him a FEW times in the manga. XD The way it was done in the fic made sense, and since both of them had been hitting the pomegranate sake a bit in-fic before Koumyou went 'okay ^_^' to the double entendres, Ukoku WOULD be less able to keep his mask perfectly in place. He drops it quite a bit around Koumyou anyway, and in such a situation, I think it's plausible that it WOULD slip completely.
But this fan just went on and on and on about how she didn't understand where this VULNERABILITY ever came into Ukoku's character, where it was in the manga, ohmygod hyperventilation look at my failure to understand that positions in bed don't affect whether or not someone has a ween, and could NOT understand the polite, well-thought-out replies from the author or other commenters at ALL. I mean, she got given page numbers and volumes and explanations of interpretation and continued to NOT GET IT on a grand scale.
People can be extremely kind to one person and then turn around and be crazily vicious to another for no real reason - or for some bullshit reason they pulled out of their anus to make themselves feel better. They can rationalize all kinds of godawful behaviour (and I don't doubt that Nii has an explanation for every single bit of crap he pulls). Vulnerability in some situations is not universal weakness, and someone's humanity will not necessarily prevent them form being a raging cock. People do horrible shit for love. Humans are compassionate, generous, kind, nurturing and decent, but they're also small-minded, selfish, nasty, careless and ass-tick-y. When I talk about Nii's humanity I'm talking about all that shit, positive and negative. XD
I don't know whether or not he screwed up Kami on purpose or whether Kami was screwed up to begin with and Nii had no idea what the fuck to do and...well, considering his examples of how2mentor are both extremely weird, and Nii is weird, Kami would most likely get weirder. I certainly think he took advantage of the kid's gigantic fucking heartmark, but I don;t know if he set out to make Kami weirder if only because Kami was already pretty bad-off mentally on account of being a war orphan and on account of having to do what he did to survive. The human psyche is both extremely fragile and extremely resilient. Messing Kami up would be easy and Nii has this Thing about challenges. Doing it rite as a teacher would be MUCH harder. PROBLEM: the teacher whom everyone says is the normal one is adfgj,yrlktkwgf yeah Goudai I still think you are a dick! ...Anyhow. Through Goudai, Nii 'figured out' that the ideal student is a very obedient sort...we can see where this is going. Even if Nii didn't set out to make Kami weirder, Kami was liable to get weirder. tl;dr I don't know WTF his intentions were in re: Kami and I probably never will.
I think it's likely that the idea of Nii having a fuckhuge crush on Koumyou or even loving him hurts some of the 'EVIL GENIUS DEITY!' fans' minds because there is this perpetuating idea in culture that love is an all-powerful force of redemption and that any person in love will be saved. That no one evil can really love. Which - okay, first of all, EVIL IS AN ABSTRACT and in many cases relative. There are people out there who would think I was fucking godawful and bosom buddies with Lucifer because I like another woman. There are people out there who think I'm a puppykicking bitch because I refuse to subscribe to their worldviews. Shit, one of my friends was once dating this sparklehorse wonkpagan thingiee who was utterly convinced I was demon possessed because I wouldn't and didn't act the way she expected me to or automatically defer to her (and people went along with this because they were not very bright and/or it was easier to throw my ass to the curb than deal with her bullshit - I assume it was the latter). I'm not even kidding. BUT I DIGRESS! Love is awesome but it's not an all-powerful all-redeeming force and it's in part Nii's love for Koumyou that leads him to be such a dickwagon to Sanzo. Love alone cannot save someone. Love is part of a much larger equation when it comes to redemption. Love all by itself is just one facet of a relationship.
It's a powerful thing. But it's not all-powerful. So yeah!
THIS GOT DISJOINTED TOO! *throws shoe and headdesks* tl;dr focusing on someone's humanity doesn't mean denying the other aspects of them. I fully recognize the fact that Nii is an ass, and it's his moments of openness and humanity that make his jackassdom that much WORSE. It's those moments that make you scream WHY WOULD YOU FUCKING DO THAT, DUDE.
I think the fans who don't think Nii is capable of love are the same fans who forget that Gonou was batshit insane and that the series does not make excuses for him (the Three Aspects remind Sanzo that Hakkai is working to redeem himself and ask him not to forget that - this is important). Hell, HAKKAI does not deny that he was batshit insane. Minekura is damn good. XD She likes Yisou (and so do I) and it's made clear that while he has a right to be angry he doesn't have a right to seek revenge like that and wreck people's lives. He has a right to be pissed off but mother of fuck he's going way too far, dude, why did you make yourself into a shiki, that's fucked up.
(I'm going to ramble some time about how Yisou is totally a hungry ghost archetype...)
XD; IN CLOSING I like Minekura a lot and I could fangirl all day but I have to cut this short because I have to run flailing off to work. Whee!
in closing, JESUS CHRIST Japan is speedy, I ordered my stuff on Thursday and it got here just now.
--
*'Dickdamsel' is an excellent term I picked up somewhere or another for the particularly-spineless whiny fangirl-Japanese-uttering sort of uke/bottom who shows up in bad slashfic.
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The lulz of a Nice Guy trying to model himself over a failass interpretation of Nii. Oh the lulz.
Seriously though man, I know that no fandom is free of durfurdehur, but you'd think Saiyuki might be a bit LESS durpful? Maybe?
I mean for crying out LOUD, how can anyone read the manga and then blah blah blah about how Yisou in the Gunlock fightan gaem (there is one, it's kinda dorky, only eight characters) makes no sense to them "because when did he ever fight hand to hand?"
WHAT DID YOU THINK THE AIKIDO-ING HAKKAI WAS, SPANKY. XD
tl;dr dumb fans are dumb and Nii's loud.